Need info on vintage Model ER
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terrymoline
- Bronze Member
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2012 12:16 pm
Need info on vintage Model ER
I've inherited a Shopsmith Model ER from my Dad. I see a lot of references to Model 10 ERs but this is just Model ER. I think it's from the 50's and it is huge. It was made, of course, by the Magna Engineering Corp in San Francisco, when they didn't even have a patent number for it yet ("patent applied for"). I have a very interested buyer but have no idea what I should ask for it. It was used very little, mostly to make a few picket fences, but has some rust on the big cylindrical bars. I would be interested to hear from anyone who can give me more information about everything this machine does besides cut, and what its value is. I know the manual must be around somewhere but I haven't found it yet!
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brad_nalor
- Gold Member
- Posts: 131
- Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2011 1:51 am
How neat. Family heirloom and realizing I don't know the situation, but if me would cherish the machine.
Value? I've seen junk rusty to virtual new condition sell from $50. But then have seen some listed in all conditions, priced over $500. I say listed, but whether they sell them for that is another thing. Usually average $150 with a bench. It seems the accessories and rare parts are always sought after. Good luck.
Value? I've seen junk rusty to virtual new condition sell from $50. But then have seen some listed in all conditions, priced over $500. I say listed, but whether they sell them for that is another thing. Usually average $150 with a bench. It seems the accessories and rare parts are always sought after. Good luck.
There is a good 10ER Forum on yahoo. They have a repository of information on gmail. If you go to http://www.gmail.com and then log in as 10ERusers and use the password: castiron You will find almost anything ever published about the 10ER. I have 5 10E/ERs. On the left side of the gmail site, click on Important and you'll see a list of articles. The very first one is the Western Machinery story. There is also 10ER on the left, so much stuff. They request you view or download and not upload if I remember correctly.
The 10ER is a tough machine. So tough that at the Shopsmith factory on Poe Avenue in Dayton, they were specially modified to do machine tool operations on the newly produced Mark Vs. I'm not sure if they still are even there as I saw then in February 2008.
I've been comparing the Mark V/Mark 7 with the old 10ERs and found like on the quill, the 10ERs used 4 bearings. CORRECTION: I learned the 10ERs did not use 4 bearings- my bad The newer Mark Vs and Mark 7 use only 2 bearings while the old Shopsmiths use a single bearing quill. Are two bearings okay? Of course they are. The new Mark 7 or a Mark V upgraded with a DVR motor has all new bearings to handle the increase from 5,200 RPM up to 10,000 RPM without using a speed increaser. The DVR motor is the cat's meow in my opinion. I think it is too large for a 10ER, but a smaller, self-contained motor might do it. I have two 1.5 HP DC tread mill motors that fit perfectly on the 10E/ER motor plate. I got involved with a home renovation which is almost complete and I want to get back and see what I can do with my 10E/ERs when I'm not making saw dust with that constant torque DVR motor.
I'm thinking maybe a 1.5 DVR motor might be perfect for a 10ER. Even a 1/2 HP might be just as good if it will fit. I recently visited the Teknatool facility in Saint Petersburg and got to see their new wood lathes. I am not a turner, but I know if I become one, that if Shopsmith is unable to handle my needs, I know Teknatool is standing by with a team of people wanting to help their customers as many people believe they are located only in New Zealand, but all I had to do was drive almost 1 mile, make one right and I drove right to the place on 34th Street in St. Pete. The Shopsmith has a much longer bed, but on the Teknatool web site is a link to a video with a guy turning a 350 lb, 12-foot log! He used two Mark V benches.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQbzEz0- ... e=youtu.be
I wish Shopsmith was closer though and also that they still had a retail store. Years ago, Shopsmith had stores all over the country. But the economy along with the lack of wood shop course in many schools has reduced the number of potential users. But I'm retired now and I want to learn all I can about wood, wood tools & processes and the Shopsmith offers me all that. I can buy new when they have sales. One DVR motor I picked up at a Lowe's demo with no interest for 18 months which means it will cost me $2.40 a day. Otherwise they are slightly over $1500 on the Shopsmith web site.
There are so many things you can do which are simply limited by your imagination. As far as parts, I have had no problem. I simply keep an eye on Ebay or Craigslist. I have two 10Es I believe and three 10ERs along with a 1954/55 Greenie, four 510s, and soon two complete Mark 7s. Each of my older ones has a speed changer. I just ordered a new quill which I plan to experiment with by using high quality bearings and seeing how fast I can get it to go. I found bearing capable of 33,000 RPM== too fast for me. But it is a hobby. Get the word out to your friends or to the other 10ER user groups and you'll find they are as good as this group in terms of helping each other out.
Cost, I haven't paid all that much. $50 here & there. $80 for a 10E that was owned from Day 1 by a machinist who kept it looking new. $150 for a totally restored 10ER. It was worth far more, but was in the middle of no place, but one of my sisters lives near the seller who's father restored it & past away. If you go for Mark Vs, there are some great deals to be had. Someone here advertised an accessory package which included a 12" stand alone planer, an Incra fence system, and much more for only $600-700- amazing! Some one else here wrote of a 520 in Maryland with a bandsaw for $600. The thread was several weeks old. But I emailed the Craigslist seller and it turns out I was the first person to call him. So you just never know.
Well, go luck & I hope you don't become addicted like me. But when someone dangles a piece a bait in front of me or makes an offer I can't refuse, I go for it. I just have too much and will have to downsize. I was going to completely rebuild 3 Mark V headstocks. I bought anything & everything I might possibly need to include anything with a bearing. After buying two DVR DIY kits, I have a bunch of brand new parts that I'll most likely new need.
Oh, estate sales and garage sales are another source of really good deals. When an original 10E/ER buyer passes ( many have been leaving us recently) the spouse and/or children have no idea of what the actual value of a 10E/ER is. They just see an old piece of junk that "Dad" used to spend hours with.
It's value is up to the owner/seller and whatever someone will pay for it. as for manuals, go to that gmail.com site & sign in like I told you & you'll have everything. There are people who rebuild them, modify them for customers, convert the motor from AC to DC and make accessories like speed changers, way tube extenders, and other items that will allow you to use Mark V SPTs on a 10E/ER. Just Google 10ER & also go to You Tube.
My journey started in 1991/2 when my parents retired from CT & went to Florida. I was handed down his 1997 Mark V Model 510 with all the SPTs and a stand alone planer. I upgraded it to a 520 and was happy. Then around 2008, I got the fever. In 4 1/2 years time I think I have at least one of anything Shopsmith ever made except for about 10 things- a Mark2, a MArk VII which Bob Fulwider in Reno wanted to sell me with all the spare parts he had. He was an original Magna Shopsmith repair person, a Crafter Station, Shopsmith 2000, the Radial Arm saw, the compressor, the paint sprayer and a few other things. My wife only saw Shopsmith boxes coming & I had to hide them before she came home...
There are many, many good people still using these old machines and I honestly believe they will last another generator or two if taken care of. good luck,
Tony
The 10ER is a tough machine. So tough that at the Shopsmith factory on Poe Avenue in Dayton, they were specially modified to do machine tool operations on the newly produced Mark Vs. I'm not sure if they still are even there as I saw then in February 2008.
I've been comparing the Mark V/Mark 7 with the old 10ERs and found like on the quill, the 10ERs used 4 bearings. CORRECTION: I learned the 10ERs did not use 4 bearings- my bad The newer Mark Vs and Mark 7 use only 2 bearings while the old Shopsmiths use a single bearing quill. Are two bearings okay? Of course they are. The new Mark 7 or a Mark V upgraded with a DVR motor has all new bearings to handle the increase from 5,200 RPM up to 10,000 RPM without using a speed increaser. The DVR motor is the cat's meow in my opinion. I think it is too large for a 10ER, but a smaller, self-contained motor might do it. I have two 1.5 HP DC tread mill motors that fit perfectly on the 10E/ER motor plate. I got involved with a home renovation which is almost complete and I want to get back and see what I can do with my 10E/ERs when I'm not making saw dust with that constant torque DVR motor.
I'm thinking maybe a 1.5 DVR motor might be perfect for a 10ER. Even a 1/2 HP might be just as good if it will fit. I recently visited the Teknatool facility in Saint Petersburg and got to see their new wood lathes. I am not a turner, but I know if I become one, that if Shopsmith is unable to handle my needs, I know Teknatool is standing by with a team of people wanting to help their customers as many people believe they are located only in New Zealand, but all I had to do was drive almost 1 mile, make one right and I drove right to the place on 34th Street in St. Pete. The Shopsmith has a much longer bed, but on the Teknatool web site is a link to a video with a guy turning a 350 lb, 12-foot log! He used two Mark V benches.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQbzEz0- ... e=youtu.be
I wish Shopsmith was closer though and also that they still had a retail store. Years ago, Shopsmith had stores all over the country. But the economy along with the lack of wood shop course in many schools has reduced the number of potential users. But I'm retired now and I want to learn all I can about wood, wood tools & processes and the Shopsmith offers me all that. I can buy new when they have sales. One DVR motor I picked up at a Lowe's demo with no interest for 18 months which means it will cost me $2.40 a day. Otherwise they are slightly over $1500 on the Shopsmith web site.
There are so many things you can do which are simply limited by your imagination. As far as parts, I have had no problem. I simply keep an eye on Ebay or Craigslist. I have two 10Es I believe and three 10ERs along with a 1954/55 Greenie, four 510s, and soon two complete Mark 7s. Each of my older ones has a speed changer. I just ordered a new quill which I plan to experiment with by using high quality bearings and seeing how fast I can get it to go. I found bearing capable of 33,000 RPM== too fast for me. But it is a hobby. Get the word out to your friends or to the other 10ER user groups and you'll find they are as good as this group in terms of helping each other out.
Cost, I haven't paid all that much. $50 here & there. $80 for a 10E that was owned from Day 1 by a machinist who kept it looking new. $150 for a totally restored 10ER. It was worth far more, but was in the middle of no place, but one of my sisters lives near the seller who's father restored it & past away. If you go for Mark Vs, there are some great deals to be had. Someone here advertised an accessory package which included a 12" stand alone planer, an Incra fence system, and much more for only $600-700- amazing! Some one else here wrote of a 520 in Maryland with a bandsaw for $600. The thread was several weeks old. But I emailed the Craigslist seller and it turns out I was the first person to call him. So you just never know.
Well, go luck & I hope you don't become addicted like me. But when someone dangles a piece a bait in front of me or makes an offer I can't refuse, I go for it. I just have too much and will have to downsize. I was going to completely rebuild 3 Mark V headstocks. I bought anything & everything I might possibly need to include anything with a bearing. After buying two DVR DIY kits, I have a bunch of brand new parts that I'll most likely new need.
Oh, estate sales and garage sales are another source of really good deals. When an original 10E/ER buyer passes ( many have been leaving us recently) the spouse and/or children have no idea of what the actual value of a 10E/ER is. They just see an old piece of junk that "Dad" used to spend hours with.
It's value is up to the owner/seller and whatever someone will pay for it. as for manuals, go to that gmail.com site & sign in like I told you & you'll have everything. There are people who rebuild them, modify them for customers, convert the motor from AC to DC and make accessories like speed changers, way tube extenders, and other items that will allow you to use Mark V SPTs on a 10E/ER. Just Google 10ER & also go to You Tube.
My journey started in 1991/2 when my parents retired from CT & went to Florida. I was handed down his 1997 Mark V Model 510 with all the SPTs and a stand alone planer. I upgraded it to a 520 and was happy. Then around 2008, I got the fever. In 4 1/2 years time I think I have at least one of anything Shopsmith ever made except for about 10 things- a Mark2, a MArk VII which Bob Fulwider in Reno wanted to sell me with all the spare parts he had. He was an original Magna Shopsmith repair person, a Crafter Station, Shopsmith 2000, the Radial Arm saw, the compressor, the paint sprayer and a few other things. My wife only saw Shopsmith boxes coming & I had to hide them before she came home...
There are many, many good people still using these old machines and I honestly believe they will last another generator or two if taken care of. good luck,
Tony
One Greenie, Two Mark 7s,Three 510s and much more…
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terrymoline
- Bronze Member
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2012 12:16 pm