Shopsmith Forums

So after watching some youtube videos and having the general inclination to give this a try, it happened today.

First despite having heard that Ace Hardware had 1/4" stainless steel rods in their stores this doesn't seem to be the case here where I live. So I used Amazon and got a 3' section for a little less then $10. I had other "stuff" to order so I made the $35 and got free shipping.

The rod came well packed in a tube, but, well the rod was not straight. I'd have to say it was put in the tube that way so I wasn't very impressed by that.

The good news is that my plan was to cut the rod in to 9" pieces so the bend will not be as obvious and should not effect things too much. Today's posting will be a bit of an over view as this is very new to me and I don't want to mislead anyone in to thinking I have this all worked out.

One tool I don't have is something that can do small detail work. A recent project (making an owl call) required me to cut some rings for o-rings and they came out wider then I would have like them. Before I do the second call I want to have a "better" way to cut those rings.

I've seen three designs that would appear to do what I want. I plan to build each of these designs. The first is just a simple flat grind at 30 degrees. The others are variations on this.

I started by cutting what I hoped would be about a 30 degree angle 9" into the rod. I did this because as I mentioned, the other tools have this same angle. Now I have a 9" section with the angled cut and the remainder of the rod also cut with that angle.

I went to my 8" bench grinder and refined the angle and flatten the cut. I did only the very basics as the round of the wheel shows up quite quickly on that long an angle. Grind and dip in water to cool many many times as I wanted the edge to stay cool.

Ones I was happy at the grinding wheel I went to the shopsmith strip sander with the sharpening fixture attached. I started with a 60 grit belt and the angle set at 30 degrees. Once the arc of the grinding wheel was gone I started working my way up with finer grit belts. The fines one I have is 600 so that is where I have stopped. I can go finer but I don't know if I need to. I'm also wondering if I want to go to a leather belt and polish the whole tool........

Here are two pictures that show the state of the tool at this point.

[ATTACH]24377[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]24378[/ATTACH]

I want to do a second version like this but with the bottom of the tool rounded near the tip. Maybe tomorrow??

Haven't started to think about the handles yet but of course I'll want a handle before I try using them. That might be a week or more out yet.

Ed

Ed
Stainless steel is hard to sharpen. Especially to get the whisker curl which is ideal for shear turning.
I have tried to get a razor sharp edge of Stainless and found it to be nearly impossible (for me). Some say 440 stainless is the key.

Have you tried sharpening these yet?

Regarding grits and sharpening lathe tools. I don't waste my time polishning the edge here. While a lathe chisel is held in the hand it really is a power tool cutter.

While you could polish the edge to a brilliant mirror finish like a bench chisel or plane, there really is no reason to. Consider the amount of feet that the tool cuts per minute. A 6 inch bowl has a circumference of 18.84 inches even at the slowest speed of a Power Pro (200 RPM) that is 314 ft of cutting in one minute. On a Mark v at 750 RPM that is 14,130 inches or 1,177.5 feet every minute of cutting Just shy of a quarter mile!! Polished edges just don't hold up under that torture.

I use a strip sander with a 100 grit belt to adjust the geometry of my lathe tools. Then I refine the edge and touch them up during use with a Coarse diamond card sharpener. For gouges I use a diamond file as a slip stone to flatten the back inside the gouge.

Even the fancy sharpening grinders typically use a 120 grit wheel. High speed cutting tools just can't retain the same 0 radius edge that a chisel or plane can.

Hi,

My original plan was to get some M2 stock or drill rod but local sources did not have any in stock. By then Capt'n Eddie had a video where he mentioned going to his Ace store and getting some SS to use.

The material I was able to get is mill grade (not polished), 91 Rockwell(B) Annealed 1/4" rod. I went with the 316 because it is often used for cutlery which is quite like what this is for.

This is a cutting tool, there is no need for a burr and in fact it has been removed. As it stands it is very sharp, if you slide it along a piece of paper then slight tip it up it slices into the paper.

What happens when this meets wood it could be another story.....

Ed

Ed in Tampa wrote:Ed
Stainless steel is hard to sharpen. Especially to get the whisker curl which is ideal for shear turning.
I have tried to get a razor sharp edge of Stainless and found it to be nearly impossible (for me). Some say 440 stainless is the key.

Have you tried sharpening these yet?

I don't recall any heat treatments for any 300 series that will temper it. I believe you need to get in to the 400 series for that.

Ed

beeg wrote:Is the steel ya got already tempered?

Thanks for your insights.
And I'm not saying I disagree with your post but simply we are at different places in our experience. I did do turning in HS and I have done projects as needed along the way but I am certainly no expert on the subject.

The last couple of years I have done a lot more lathe work and since that is one of the areas I can explore during winter I plan to do more and more. In fact a lot of my tool inventory of lathe related tools has been in purchased during this period means I have invested in this as a growing interest.

I would say that more then half of last years tool budget was lather related, it might well be a higher percentage this year. The problem is my interest is out growing my ability to purchase things I want. The solution might be to me making a few tools myself rather then having to purchase them.

Thus this project. The $10 for steel, that will make 4 tools, seems pretty cheap. Yes I will need material for the handles but even at that I might be talking less then $8 per tool were as these tools sell for over $33 each. Four test tools for the price of one store bought one, well it has potential.

Please bear with me as I learn.

From my research on this style of tool it would appear that it needs to be really sharp. Hence my approach of going to 600 grit, and even thinking of polishing.

I would expect limited time on wood as it is not going to be used for much other then small details. This is one of the reasons I'm going with this material, which might or might not be a good decision.

Since I have additional shopsmiths I can afford to set up the strip sander while turning so even if I were to drop a tool I'm no more then 10 minutes away from being able to use it again. While I used an 8" grinder to do the early shaping once I got to the strip sander it was less then 10 minutes to the state it is now. Polishing would be a couple minutes longer.

Once handled I can check out just how sharp I need to keep the tool. If I can get by at 120 grit then so be it.

I find that what ever grit I decide as my final one it is very easy to keep the edge so long as you touch it up often. I rarely need to go even one grit size back. A touch up is a job that takes seconds to do so long as you do it often.

I do use diamond stones but I've found my muscle memory is not that good on lathe tools, and it hasn't improved much so I tend to save it for the other tools that I can do a better job on. Or perhaps I just don't have the right stones??? Yea lets blame it on the stones.

Checking the temperature it would appear I can now head to the shop and give another tool a shot.

Ed

terrydowning wrote:Regarding grits and sharpening lathe tools. I don't waste my time polishning the edge here. While a lathe chisel is held in the hand it really is a power tool cutter.

While you could polish the edge to a brilliant mirror finish like a bench chisel or plane, there really is no reason to. Consider the amount of feet that the tool cuts per minute. A 6 inch bowl has a circumference of 18.84 inches even at the slowest speed of a Power Pro (200 RPM) that is 314 ft of cutting in one minute. On a Mark v at 750 RPM that is 14,130 inches or 1,177.5 feet every minute of cutting Just shy of a quarter mile!! Polished edges just don't hold up under that torture.

I use a strip sander with a 100 grit belt to adjust the geometry of my lathe tools. Then I refine the edge and touch them up during use with a Coarse diamond card sharpener. For gouges I use a diamond file as a slip stone to flatten the back inside the gouge.

Even the fancy sharpening grinders typically use a 120 grit wheel. High speed cutting tools just can't retain the same 0 radius edge that a chisel or plane can.

While you are having fun making lathe tools, here is one that is similar but different somehow. Drozda Vortex Tool

I agree with you Ed. Lathe tools tend to be spendy and I support your decision to try making your own. I'm looking forward to the results. As for handles, just grab whatever cutoffs you have, drill the correct size hole for the stock and turn them to the desired shape. I mean, you have a lathe and some turning tools already. Epoxy the handle in place. I made a thin parting tool from a dull reciprocating saw blade. I used some plum stock for the handle and used a section of 3/4" copper pipe that has been in my shop as a ferule.

Here it is next my SS Skew for comparison

[ATTACH]24385[/ATTACH]

Thanks I'll look at that tonight. Hope this doesn't mean I have to try yet another build or purchase....

Ed

rpd wrote:While you are having fun making lathe tools, here is one that is similar but different somehow. Drozda Vortex Tool