Yesterday, I received and installed the Carter guide system on the band saw.
I know that many guys don't feel that they help in any appreciable fashion, but WOW, what a difference they make on my saw with the 5/8, 4 TPI blade.
I was able to resaw a 3/16" X 5" with absolutely no deviation and, even though previous set up attempts indicated there was a need for a cocked fence to accommodate for drift, a squared up fence was used with beautiful results.
I'm sold!
BTW, I increased the speed from "Slow" to the "B" setting, as suggested. I had tried this setting before installing the Carter guides and it helped a little, but now, it's darned near perfect.
Out With the Old and In With the New
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Re: Out With the Old and In With the New
Hello from Somerset in the beautiful Pennsylvania Laurel Highlands.
Mark 7, Mark VII, Mark V 520, Mark V 510 x 2, Mark V 500
SPT's - Band Saw, Jig Saw, Belt Sander, Jointer, strip sander, Oscillating Sander, Speed Increaser
SS Freestanding - Pro Planer, Scroll Saw, Overarm Pin Router, Power Station, DC3000 x 2
Made for SS - Incra iBox, Ring Master
"Honest dear, I can quit any time I want."
Mark 7, Mark VII, Mark V 520, Mark V 510 x 2, Mark V 500
SPT's - Band Saw, Jig Saw, Belt Sander, Jointer, strip sander, Oscillating Sander, Speed Increaser
SS Freestanding - Pro Planer, Scroll Saw, Overarm Pin Router, Power Station, DC3000 x 2
Made for SS - Incra iBox, Ring Master
"Honest dear, I can quit any time I want."
Re: Out With the Old and In With the New
Yep, Jim. That's them.
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dusty
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Re: Out With the Old and In With the New
OKAY, Gene, I', listening. I am one of the nay sayers. What do Carter Guide System do for is not done by the cool blocks?Gene Howe wrote:Yesterday, I received and installed the Carter guide system on the band saw.
I know that many guys don't feel that they help in any appreciable fashion, but WOW, what a difference they make on my saw with the 5/8, 4 TPI blade.
I was able to resaw a 3/16" X 5" with absolutely no deviation and, even though previous set up attempts indicated there was a need for a cocked fence to accommodate for drift, a squared up fence was used with beautiful results.
I'm sold!
BTW, I increased the speed from "Slow" to the "B" setting, as suggested. I had tried this setting before installing the Carter guides and it helped a little, but now, it's darned near perfect.
I already understand that the bearings provide a frictionless guide but that doesn't change the blade performance. When I am resawing, I run the cool blocks firm against the blade; the blade does not twist.
Can the Carter Guides be employed with a narrow bandsaw blade? The resaw blade is at one end of the dichotomy but do they work at the other extreme?
In terms of bearing noise, is there a significant difference with the Carter Guides? Permanently eliminating that squeal would be a very significant factor for me.
If you are permanantly eliminating cool blocks from your bandsaw, I have a goody box here where the abandoned hardware can be deposited for future use.
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Re: Out With the Old and In With the New
Dusty, the first thing you notice is that the Carter guides provide more "guide surface" than the cool blocks. I'm just guessing that the bearings are close to 1/2" long. I'll measure later.
Second, their design decreases the amount of unsupported blade because the lower guides are a bit closer to the under side of the table.
I set the guides .0012 from the blade. Seemed to work fine. I was always a bit leery of setting the cool blocks tight against the blade as the friction would inevitably create heat, not good for a band saw blade. And, my cool blocks always wore unevenly. More off the front sides. An evidence of blade twist. Operator caused, I'm sure.
The guides just replace the stock guides. The back up bearing squeal is still there.
Of course the nearly perfect cut was proof enough for me, but not needing to account for drift in setting the fence was an added factor that indicates their up graded utility.
Second, their design decreases the amount of unsupported blade because the lower guides are a bit closer to the under side of the table.
I set the guides .0012 from the blade. Seemed to work fine. I was always a bit leery of setting the cool blocks tight against the blade as the friction would inevitably create heat, not good for a band saw blade. And, my cool blocks always wore unevenly. More off the front sides. An evidence of blade twist. Operator caused, I'm sure.
The guides just replace the stock guides. The back up bearing squeal is still there.
Of course the nearly perfect cut was proof enough for me, but not needing to account for drift in setting the fence was an added factor that indicates their up graded utility.
Re: Out With the Old and In With the New
Update:
The Carter guides are 7/16 long. When using a 5/8 blade, setting the new guides to just behind the gullet, no part of the blade behind the gullet is unsupported.
When I next use a 3/8 blade, I'll report on it's performance. For the 1/4 and 1/8 blades, I use the Carter stabilizer. Also a nice upgrade.
The Carter guides are 7/16 long. When using a 5/8 blade, setting the new guides to just behind the gullet, no part of the blade behind the gullet is unsupported.
When I next use a 3/8 blade, I'll report on it's performance. For the 1/4 and 1/8 blades, I use the Carter stabilizer. Also a nice upgrade.
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dusty
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Re: Out With the Old and In With the New
Gene, I was almost a convert. Neither because I need to do a lot of resawing nor because I need to get better resaw results but just because I tinker a lot. I would be in hog heaven if I had a job that required me to build up and tear down wood working equipment and give my opinions of how it went.
Yesterday and today I have been tinkering with one of my band saws; the one that has the Woodslicer resaw blade.
I redressed the four cool blocks and set them .001 off the blade. I replaced the tracking bearings, hoping that they would quit singing to me. They did not but they are better aligned than they were. When I started this effort today, the blade was tracking about the thickness of the blade off center. This caused the blade to dart back and forth between its natural line of travel and where the bearings were trying to position it.
For the final proof of performance, I ripped (against the fence) a board to give me a 1" piece about 3' long. I am seldom successful at doing that with the band saw due to "mythical blade drift". Eye balling it against a ruler (marked in 64ths), I see no deviation.
Next I set out to resaw with the objective of getting a piece 3/16" thick. I failed on dimension but I got a very consistent 5/32" thick piece that deviates a maximum of .006" around the entire perimeter of the cutoff.
A Carter Retrofit would probably improve those results some but for the resawing that I do, it would not benefit me enough to off set the cost.
The vast majority of my resaw work is to get 1/2" thick stock from rough cut lumber. I resaw knowing that I am headed for either the jointer or the surface planer. If pieces of matching thickness are my target, I typically finish with the surface planer.
It was a worthwhile effort. My band saw is all tuned up. I talked myself into saving the cost of a Carter retrofit and I got rid of a bunch of cut offs that are now either saw dust or very thin pieces of scrap.
I'm sticking with the "old" -- at least for now.
Yesterday and today I have been tinkering with one of my band saws; the one that has the Woodslicer resaw blade.
I redressed the four cool blocks and set them .001 off the blade. I replaced the tracking bearings, hoping that they would quit singing to me. They did not but they are better aligned than they were. When I started this effort today, the blade was tracking about the thickness of the blade off center. This caused the blade to dart back and forth between its natural line of travel and where the bearings were trying to position it.
For the final proof of performance, I ripped (against the fence) a board to give me a 1" piece about 3' long. I am seldom successful at doing that with the band saw due to "mythical blade drift". Eye balling it against a ruler (marked in 64ths), I see no deviation.
Next I set out to resaw with the objective of getting a piece 3/16" thick. I failed on dimension but I got a very consistent 5/32" thick piece that deviates a maximum of .006" around the entire perimeter of the cutoff.
A Carter Retrofit would probably improve those results some but for the resawing that I do, it would not benefit me enough to off set the cost.
The vast majority of my resaw work is to get 1/2" thick stock from rough cut lumber. I resaw knowing that I am headed for either the jointer or the surface planer. If pieces of matching thickness are my target, I typically finish with the surface planer.
It was a worthwhile effort. My band saw is all tuned up. I talked myself into saving the cost of a Carter retrofit and I got rid of a bunch of cut offs that are now either saw dust or very thin pieces of scrap.
I'm sticking with the "old" -- at least for now.
Last edited by dusty on Fri Feb 06, 2015 5:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Re: Out With the Old and In With the New
My resaw efforts were horrible!
The resawing I do is about the same as yours. Rough to 3/4'-1/4", then to the planer or jointer.
I have several mesquite logs that need to be cut down to a size I can get to the band saw. Then, I'll want to get as close of a cut as I can.
Changing to the Carter guides forced me to do a bit of tune up. Nothing was too far out of the norm, though.
I wish we were closer. I'd like you to see the difference the new guides make.
The resawing I do is about the same as yours. Rough to 3/4'-1/4", then to the planer or jointer.
I have several mesquite logs that need to be cut down to a size I can get to the band saw. Then, I'll want to get as close of a cut as I can.
Changing to the Carter guides forced me to do a bit of tune up. Nothing was too far out of the norm, though.
I wish we were closer. I'd like you to see the difference the new guides make.
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dusty
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Re: Out With the Old and In With the New
If we were closer, you'd likely convince me to blow my budget. The Woodslicer blade made a big difference in how my band saw works. Prior to gett ing that new blade, my resaw results were horrible.
Hmmm, maybe I need to switch back to the old blade to verify that.
However, if you tackle mesquite successfully, you definitely have the right combination at work for you. I have been using hardwood cut offs but nothing as hard as mesquite.
Hmmm, maybe I need to switch back to the old blade to verify that.
However, if you tackle mesquite successfully, you definitely have the right combination at work for you. I have been using hardwood cut offs but nothing as hard as mesquite.
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Re: Out With the Old and In With the New
Dusty, I second Gene's experience with the Carter bandsaw upgrade.
One added feature that helps with re-sawing IMHO is that the Carter bearings are set AGAINST the blade and do not need to be 'a business card away' or something. Much easier to adjust, and as Gene pointed out they do not wear as did my tool guides.
I have had them installed for several months and have re-sawn hard maple, mahogany and lately cherry up to 5 inches.
With these and the WoodSlicer (what a blade!) I have cut down to ½ inch with a straight up fence that does not need to be 'aligned' to any drift angle.
On an upcoming project, I am going to try to cut real veneer down to ⅛ inch (I think that is okay).
Worth it in my experience. I now re-saw without worrying about drift, just keep the wood against the fence.
Forrest
One added feature that helps with re-sawing IMHO is that the Carter bearings are set AGAINST the blade and do not need to be 'a business card away' or something. Much easier to adjust, and as Gene pointed out they do not wear as did my tool guides.
I have had them installed for several months and have re-sawn hard maple, mahogany and lately cherry up to 5 inches.
With these and the WoodSlicer (what a blade!) I have cut down to ½ inch with a straight up fence that does not need to be 'aligned' to any drift angle.
On an upcoming project, I am going to try to cut real veneer down to ⅛ inch (I think that is okay).
Worth it in my experience. I now re-saw without worrying about drift, just keep the wood against the fence.
Forrest