A new adventure begins !

[masonsailor2]

A new adventure begins. On Monday we close escrow on a new home in Las Vegas. From the beach to the desert. Go figure. We used my VA loan benefit for the second time and it has all gone pretty well. The move was necessary for business purposes. California has become untenable for us business wise so we had to move our company to Nevada. This will be an extensive remodel so I will be busy for a year or two. The shop will go into full swing. She wants an Art Deco theme which is always challenging. It will involve a complete redo with new flooring, cabinets, stairs, interior/exterior doors and probably windows. I have never had a shop in the desert so this could get interesting. It will be air conditioned to allow us to work during the summer. Not sure how that will effect the wood. I know some of you have shops in the more arid areas so any advice would be welcome. Her choice of woods will have to be tempered due to cost. In the past we did our homes in Honduran mahogany but that will probably be out of the question due to its recent price increases. Keeping her color preferences in mind I will probably go with Jatoba which will give her the reddish brown color. I have worked with it before and although very dense it finishes well and is still in the 4-5 dollar/bd ft range. Due to its hardness it is strictly a carbide tooling operation so if that is the choice spiral cutter heads are in order for planer and jointer. So how do I deal with the air conditioning issue ? I will need to cool the space but also need to keep it fairly dry to keep the humidity gradient as small as possible between shop and ambient. If not it could be a disaster.
Paul

[algale]

Good luck with the move! Sapele might be a good alternative to mahogany and it works with HSS just fine.

[Gene Howe]

There's a few of us desert rats here, Paul.
You'll likely not experience much, if any, issues with wood movement in LV.
As far as cooling a shop is concerned, a roof mounted Mastercool is an inexpensive option. It'll keep you cool as long as the dew point is below 50.
Both our sons in Tucson have worked in machine shops with Mastercools for cooling. They've not experienced rust problems.
My shop is extremely well insulated and it will hold the cool night air for most of the day. However, we seldom reach 100.
Winters in the shop may be just as problematic as summers.
Some of our other "rats" will surely chime in with their favorite strategies, too.

[benush26]

Not certain if this will be of any help, but a couple years back I was planning a move to Mesquite (about 80 miles north of Las Vegas). I looked at a number of places with attached garages to use as a shop, but none had AC piped to them, but well insulated. I asked the real estate agent if she knew any woodworkers in the town and what they used. She said a few of them were using the split systems (like Mitsubishi and Fujitsu) however most like here Dad were using an evaporative (aka swamp)cooler. I asked her about air filtration but she had no idea.
Personally I might question whether a split system design could handle the large amount of saw dust since it's design is for in a home, but maybe with an addition of a dedicated overhead air filtration system it "might" be viable. I liked the idea of one unit for both heating and cooling, but then I do live in a fantasy world most of the time.
Just a thought.

Be well,
Ben

[dusty]

My shop, here in Tucson, is simply a two car garage that has been re-purposed. There hasn't been a car in that space for many, many years. As for heating and cooling - I live with whatever nature provides. Sometimes, during the winter months, that means I don't start work in the shop until after the sun comes up. I then open the overhead garage door and let the sun shine in. The garage faces east. In the summer time, cooling can become an issue. When that happens, I come inside. That is why I am here at the computer now. It is 100° + in the shop right now. When it is too hot, I just don't work in the shop. That means I lose a few afternoons during the hotter time of the year.

Somehow I get the indication that this system will not work for Paul. I think the shop there might be multi-functional.

Swamp coolers work in the dry desert but they do drive the humidity in the cooled spaces upwards. For that reason, I am not inclined to recommend swamp-cooling. We built the house in the late 70s and installed central air in the late 80s. The swamp cooler was trashed at that time.

Hmmm -- This reminds me, I have a motor from that cooler somewhere.

[jsburger]

I never found a problem with a swamp cooler in the shop. Before I built my dedicated shop I worked out of my two car garage for 7 or 8 years with a large window mounted swamp cooler. Never a problem due to the moisture introduced by the swamp cooler. Remember everything is relative.

My house is cooled 24/7 with a roof mounted swamp cooler. Right now it is 94* and 20% humidity outside. Inside the humidity is 44%. How many days back east is the daily ambient humidity less than 40%?

The idea that swamp coolers introduce overwhelming moisture/humidity is simply not true in my experience.

[jmadden]

Welcome to Nevada. I live in Henderson, NV which is 1" from Las Vegas. Henderson is the SW end of the valley.
My shop is my garage and it is not air conditioned. Therefore, during the summer months I do no woodworking. This past June had 28 days over 100 and so far July has been all over 100. This coming weeks forecast is an average of 110. That being said, the fall, winter and early spring are perfect. And remember you won't have state income tax so you can buy lots of tools. Another place for the $ is all the great restaurants and entertainment.

[charlese]

... I have never had a shop in the desert so this could get interesting. It will be air conditioned to allow us to work during the summer. Not sure how that will effect the wood. I know some of you have shops in the more arid areas so any advice would be welcome....
Paul

A/C takes moisture out of the air. That's why they drip water. It is a natural function of condensation.

I love the desert air. Single digit humidity dries wood. Not a bad thing unless you are going to send a newly made table to New Orleans. (so to speak) But it is good for woodworking.

There's a table that shows % of wood moisture when in equilibrium with surrounding air humidity. I can;t copy it as it won't fit in the forum without folding. So you can look it up here - http://www.woodweb.com/Resources/wood_e ... l_2010.pdf Chapter 4 table 2.

[jsburger]

... I have never had a shop in the desert so this could get interesting. It will be air conditioned to allow us to work during the summer. Not sure how that will effect the wood. I know some of you have shops in the more arid areas so any advice would be welcome....
Paul

A/C takes moisture out of the air. That's why they drip water. It is a natural function of condensation.

I love the desert air. Single digit humidity dries wood. Not a bad thing unless you are going to send a newly made table to New Orleans. (so to speak) But it is good for woodworking.

There's a table that shows % of wood moisture when in equilibrium with surrounding air humidity. I can;t copy it as it won't fit in the forum without folding. So you can look it up here - http://www.woodweb.com/Resources/wood_e ... l_2010.pdf Chapter 4 table 2.

So what is the recommended moisture content of wood? Can we say 10% to 12%? I know there are MANY other factors.

From the above chart 60%-75% humidity at 80* +- a bunch will maintain that moisture in the wood. The higher the temperature for a given humidity the lower the moisture content in the wood.

In the dry areas of the country where swamp coolers work (low ambient humidity) they will never introduce that much humidity in a building/room /shop to make a difference. The shop will still be dryer than a shop in Miami or New Orleans or probably most places back east..

[masonsailor2]

Thank you all for the input. The link was very useful Chuck. The property has a three car garage that I will be using until I get a shop built. I will be limited to the two car side only. My wife has made it clear that her "baby" will not be parked in the sun. Our daily drivers will have to be parked under a covered driveway until the shop is built. I should be able to tap into the HVAC from the house and insulate the doors which will help. I won't be able to have down time for the shop due to heat or cold as that would extend the time frame of the project by a year or so. Using an evaporative cooling system for the new shop may be an option. It doesn't sound like introducing moisture into the shop will be an issue as it is so very dry there. Are evaporative coolers that much more energy efficient ? I have absolutely no experience with them.
Paul