Horizontal Table Wobble

[keonep]

I have been having some trouble with my new to me shopsmith 510. I have everything on the table locked and have double checked the table for any cracks or loose bolts but everything is tightened down. I've removed the table and flipped it upside down on a bench to see if I can find where the wobble is coming from and it almost seems like the posts are a hair loose but I'm not really positive.

While pushing on the side of the table it wobbles horizontally and it wobbles with very little pressure. Even just pushing wood up against my rip fence will make the table slightly move giving me uneven cuts.

Here is a video of what is happening, I'm just pushing on the side of the table with very little pressure.

https://imgur.com/a/565kgLA

Any tips?

[edma194]

Looks like you're rocking the whole machine because the drum sander appears to move, or are you just holding the camera when you push it?

Ok, the carriage gets locked on the way tubes, and the legs get locked in the carriage, and the tie bar is press fit to the legs, and the trunnions lock on hinge pins on the tie bar, and the table top is bolted to the trunnions. Hopefully the problem is in just one of those connections. With the table upside down on the bench you should feel equivalent movement pushing on the end of the legs. Make sure the top is clamped to the bench, don't try to hold it while you push on the legs.

If it's not moving the same way then the problem is in the carriage, either in the leg height lock, or the way tube locks.

[keonep]

The camera is resting on the bench and the only thing moving is the table, the saw blade is stationary when I push on the side of the table.

The table top bolts are tight and I don't get any up and down play so I don't think it's the trunnions. Those are also tight. I'll see if i can place something else in the carriage to see if maybe it's that.

[reible]

A first guess would be at the legs where they are installed to the table carriage. There is drive pin of sorts that is tapered and driven in place. If some one at some time removed those pins it is possible that they either did not drive them in enough or attempted to reuse the old ones. That is where I would start looking.

Ed

[DLB]

I agree with Ed (reible) as a start point especially since that is where you think you see movement. In the very small sample I've done the pin should sit slightly proud on both ends. The pins are not very re-usable, so first try driving them in a bit first if they are not right. Inexplicably, I don't see the pins on the exploded parts diagram.(?) I got bad tubes with a kit and ended up doing pins three or four times. They are replaced in the Double Tilt Upgrade, you can find a part number and detailed instructions here: https://www.shopsmith.com/ownersite/man ... _04-12.pdf Instructions for the table tubes start on page 10 and show the correct directions for installing/removing. Since they are tapered, you do not want to go the wrong direction.

If not that, my second guess would be that the trunnion locks are not working correctly. There are two locks on 510 and on, both needed for effective locking. The lock handle can be tight with at least one lock not locked. This can usually be resolved by disassembling, inspecting, and cleaning.

And be aware that you won't achieve perfection. Marks suffer from a bit of instability that is a design trade-off for 135 degrees of table rotation. Yours is abnormal for sure, but several thousandths of movement with light to moderate pressure is 'normal.' Tying the main table and extension table together with the tubes is the easiest way to improve this for most setups, at least on 520.

- David

[RFGuy]

The camera is resting on the bench and the only thing moving is the table, the saw blade is stationary when I push on the side of the table.

The table top bolts are tight and I don't get any up and down play so I don't think it's the trunnions. Those are also tight. I'll see if i can place something else in the carriage to see if maybe it's that.

From the video, it doesn't look like the sawblade is stationary. If you look closely at the video you can see the lower saw guard (through the tablesaw insert slot) moving back and forth. I think this is kind of an optical illusion, i.e. the sawblade "appears" static and not moving but in reality is moving with everything in my opinion. You can even see the sawblade move left and right relative to a stain on the wall behind it on the left side. Can you confirm that the legs are solidly on the floor and that the casters are raised? To me, this looks like the casters are not fully retracted up as they should be. There is a cam on the mechanism for these that raises and lowers the casters (wheels) up and down. My guess is that this is the cause, or at least the first thing to check...

[jsburger]

The camera is resting on the bench and the only thing moving is the table, the saw blade is stationary when I push on the side of the table.

The table top bolts are tight and I don't get any up and down play so I don't think it's the trunnions. Those are also tight. I'll see if i can place something else in the carriage to see if maybe it's that.

From the video, it doesn't look like the sawblade is stationary. If you look closely at the video you can see the lower saw guard (through the tablesaw insert slot) moving back and forth. I think this is kind of an optical illusion, i.e. the sawblade "appears" static and not moving but in reality is moving with everything in my opinion. You can even see the sawblade move left and right relative to a stain on the wall behind it on the left side. Can you confirm that the legs are solidly on the floor and that the casters are raised? To me, this looks like the casters are not fully retracted up as they should be. There is a cam on the mechanism for these that raises and lowers the casters (wheels) up and down. My guess is that this is the cause, or at least the first thing to check...

That was my first thought. Looking at the blade in relation to the wall behind it seemed to me the blade was also moving. The OP said above...

" Even just pushing wood up against my rip fence will make the table slightly move giving me uneven cuts. "

If the table/fence is moving during a cut in relation to the blade that is a recipe for a kick back

[algale]

The camera is resting on the bench ...

Resting on what bench? Do you mean the camera it is resting on the main table?

Regardless, something is very wrong. The main table has some inherent lateral movement when everything is locked down, but nothing remotely near that amount of movement you are seeing.

I would be inclined to think that the entire machine is swaying -- loose way tubes or bench tubes in the legs/base castings.

[keonep]

The camera is resting on the front of the main table so when I push to the side of the front the main table, it rotates which is why the blade looks like it's moving. You can look at the gaps between in the blade and the table insert and see that it's getting smaller and bigger as the main table moves.

[dusty]

I'm skeptical about what I see. I would like to view both the saw blade and the table, when the table is allegidly being moved, with the camera seating somewhere that is absolutely stable.

My original thought was that the carriage is not properly locked to the Way tubes.

If I had to resolve this apparent instability, I would begin my convincing myself that the headstock and carriage do not move (with respect to one another and then work upward from the carriage (table legs, trunnions, table bolts, table).