10E versus the 10ER

[Real1shepperd]

I have a friend down in Laguna Beach who's been trying to find a nice 10ER there for over a year. I posted about this in other threads. For whatever reason, the sellers in SoCal list them with pics, but aren't present to actually show or sell them. It's insane. It became a running joke between us about how he was going to connect and actually get to see one for sale. In any event, one turned up here in the PNW for $100....a 10E. I drove four hours to get it for him(one way).

It's got some weirdness compared to my 10ER and is a bit more primitive. For example, the motor has sheaves on either end. I assume to run accessories like the jigsaw(which came with it). No switch on the headstock, but on the motor...that can't be stock? There is no tightening clamp on the end of the fence, was that an early model thing?

The seller thought it was bought in 1947...his grandpa. I should run the serial against the known database for age. My goal is to get it cleaned up for him and get as much 10ER stuff on it as possible. It does have an early speed changer, although the sheaves were in a drawer and he was just using one belt. The speed changer bushings look rough, so I'm going to replace those.

What kind of differences can I expect between a '47 10E and my '53 10ER? Is there anything I can't update to 10ER form?

Kevin

[JPG]

=======================1OE============10ER
RIP FENCE ------------ NO REAR CLAMP-----HAS CLAMP
QUILL FEED SCALE----NO SCALE------------HAS SCALE
AUX TABLE-------------WOOD/POSTS-------METAL
TAIL STOCK------------CAST IN MT2--------ADJ INSERT MOUNT
TAIL STOCK -----------LARGE STUDS-------TAPPED HOLE-------------AUX TABLE MOUNT

NOT ALL INCLUSIVE, BUT MOST OBVIOUS

If you have an older speed changer, do NOT adjust past 5.

Motors were an optional item and third party versions are common.

[jpdalton]

What kind of differences can I expect between a '47 10E and my '53 10ER? Is there anything I can't update to 10ER form?

You’re a good friend to do that sort of traveling to find and update this machine!

There’s a very nice document that was prepared by another Forums contributor, Everett Davis, that outlines a lot of the changes in the Model 10 series of machines during their run:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xxm342 ... p=drivesdk

…so you may want to refer to that. The most impactful updates you can make are the tailstock, extension table, and table fence. Magna even figured that out fairly early on and offered a kit to Model 10e owners:
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There was an accessory that was made to retrofit the original table fence with a rear hook, but those are very rare and hard to find, so your best bet may be a 10er fence. Here’s an example of the retrofit:
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IMG_4304.jpeg (830.25 KiB) Viewed 4516 times

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The PNW is where a lot of the very earliest 10e’s were shipped, so definitely check that serial number - you may even have one of that original lot (Serial Numbers 1001-1250) shipped to Montgomery Ward for Christmas 1947.

And while it has some quirks, don’t dismiss your 10e as not being a lot of fun to use just as is. Here’s mine all fixed up - works great!
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IMG_4305.jpeg (782.95 KiB) Viewed 4516 times

[JPG]

With an ER in the background no less!

[Real1shepperd]

Thanks, John for that info! I was thinking about just getting a newer 10ER fence anyway. Yeah, I don't need 'rare', I need it working quickly.

I suppose I might have him keep the double sheave motor and he uses it like it's been used. I may rewire it though so he has the switch in the headstock like normal. Funky plywood stand with the drawer on the opposite side where you stand. I don't like that. I think it has the metal extension table in the stuff that came with it.....just not an updated fence, which seems odd.

eBay seems to be drying up slowly on 10E/10ER parts. There were a lot more parts available a yr ago.

I'll check out that link for the model changes too....it will help me understand the differences. Thanks again!

Also, thanks to JPG for that list of differences!

Kevin

[chapmanruss]

Kevin,

I got home yesterday after having driven just over 16 hours each way to bring home a Mark 5 Greenie. It is from my wife's uncle and it was nice to visit with them too.

JPG listed most of the major differences between the 10E and 10ER. There were a lot of changes made during the production of the Model 10's beginning in late 1947 through 1953. I have found 7 Headstock versions plus some anomalies alone. The Headstock casting had the most changes. John is correct that the original 250 Model 10E' Shopsmith's were shipped to west coast Montgomery Ward stores. I own three. For use I recommend having the metal Extension Table with correct Tailstock and the Rip Fence with the rear lock. It's fairly easy to find those if not with the Model 10E you bought.

As for the motor, the Model 10E and 10ER were sold with or without a motor. Double shaft motors can be found on a Model 10. I have had them on a couple of the ones I have restored. There is really no use for the motor shaft on the Quill end of the Headstock. The Jig Saw is driven by the Quill's Spindle. If that motor works, put a protective cover over the Quill end shaft for protection.

Below is one I restored with a double ended motor. A cover was added to the Quill end prior to it being sold.

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10ER R41856.jpg (94.78 KiB) Viewed 4379 times

[Real1shepperd]

Russ,
It looks like they were driving the jigsaw by the inner motor sheave. I mean that's just a guess on my part. There's a metal plate on the bench where something was mounted to use that sheave. That's not attractive to me, I probably won't use it.

I'll tell him we need a rip fence and the bushings in the speed changer for starters. Once he sells his home in Laguna Beach he's moving back here. I'll post the serial # when I have more time. Thanks for all the info!

Kevin

[rebasnop]

I recently encountered this issue while refurbishing a later Model A-34 Jig Saw. Previously, the Upper Chuck Assembly was caught within the Spring Cylinder Assembly; however, it is now capable of rotating freely.

[nv10er]

Good morning, I have recently parted out a 10ER and have quite a few parts that I will be preparing for sale. Id be happy to give you the fence, and anything else to help you out with your 10E, for free if we can figure out how to get it to you. I’m in northern Nevada. Let me know…

[Real1shepperd]

"Good morning, I have recently parted out a 10ER and have quite a few parts that I will be preparing for sale. Id be happy to give you the fence, and anything else to help you out with your 10E, for free if we can figure out how to get it to you. I’m in northern Nevada. Let me know…"

I would very much like a 10ER rip fence! Happy to pay for the shipping. The drill chuck is missing. I really need my friend here to help decide how far he wants to go with the 10E. If it were just me, I'd update it with as many 10ER parts as possible. He's supposed to be back here at the end of July.

I have no room in my shop to park it, so it's going to be covered outside. We don't get any rain during the summer and most of Sept, so I'm OK to do that. When I cover it tomorrow, I'll try to better assess what we have.

Kevin