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Routing a moulding

br549

Before I attempt something I have never tried before, I would like to hear if what I plan to make is feasible and can be done safely.

The bit I have purchased is this:

The material to be used is cedar, or possibly white pine (1"x 2").

With Shopsmith in drill press mode, bit mounted in router chuck, rip fence between bit and way tubes, stock should be fed from back to front? Move fence closer to bit after each pass (cutting no more than 1/8" each pass) until profile complete and guide bearing is rubbing against stock?

Rockler 2141.jpg

edma194

I would start out by using wider stock, routing the profile on one edge, then cutting off the narrow piece of molding. This is the kind of thing that is easy to do with a handheld router if you have one and then you can leave the Shopsmith in table saw mode to cut off the finished molding.

I prefer not trapping the board between the fence and the router bit but if you do them I think passing the board left to right should be done. A right to left pass in front of the bit would be preferred, and since you have a guide bearing a fence is not really needed.

Pine and cedar should be easy to cut. Do you have a PowerPro or are using a conventional headstock limited to 5200RPM? It's a fairly wide diameter bit so should cut well at the top but the bottom shape is somewhat delicate, you could watch for tight straight grain at that edge, and of course avoid knots on that edge.

thunderbirdbat

Be careful of feed direction as it depends on direction the router bit is traveling, you want to feed the wood into the oncoming router cutting edge. The router bits are designed to rotate clockwise, if you are routing between the way tubes and the bit, right to left feed and if in front of both the way tubes and bit then left to right feed direction.

DLB

br549 wrote Before I attempt something I have never tried before, I would like to hear if what I plan to make is feasible and can be done safely.

The bit I have purchased is this:

Rockler 2141.jpg

The material to be used is cedar, or possibly white pine (1"x 2").

With Shopsmith in drill press mode, bit mounted in router chuck, rip fence between bit and way tubes, stock should be fed from back to front? Move fence closer to bit after each pass (cutting no more than 1/8" each pass) until profile complete and guide bearing is rubbing against stock?

I feel like I'm kind of reading between the lines a bit. Are you planning to fully profile a face of the 1 X 2? (1-5/8" profile, 1-1/2" stock) Which won't work the normal way because you are cutting away the reference surface that should ride the fence. And for that reason you are wondering about cutting with the material between fence and cutter as opposed to burying the cutter in the fence.(?) I've never done that, so a general comment: cutters of this type pull the material into the cutter, which is normally buried in the fence so it just helps guide the material along the fence. If you cut the other side of the material it is going to try to pull into the cutter and away from the fence. That seems bad, and I doubt the bearing's effectiveness if that happens.

If my assumptions are right, I think Rhode Island Ed had the best idea, cut the profile on larger stock with the bit buried in the fence and cut down to finished size after it is profiled. There may be some other ideas on utube or something, I've never done anything like this on a face away from the fence. I've always thought of it as one of those things you don't do.

- David

Hobbyman2

A profile of your completed piece would be nice , the bit only shows the cut you are after not the entire profile of the finished piece ,this could make a difference in the way you go about it , is this on the edge or face of the stock ? how thick is the stock or how wide is the face ? practice on a scrap piece .. make several passes dont try to take it all off in one pass . oh and there will be dust !!

BuckeyeDennis

The issue of trapping a workpiece between a router bit and a fence came up a several years ago. Check out this thread, and see if it sheds any light on the subject.

If it were me, I’d either use a shaper fence, or add a deep facing to the regular rip fence, such that the bit can be buried in the facing. If you have a 520 fence, that could be as simple as mounting a couple of short pieces of a 2x4 to the side T-slot, with one piece on each side of the bit.

I’d also mill the profile in multiple passes. On the final pass I typically use a straightedge to set the fence facing flush with the guide bearing, although there’s no real harm in the bearing being proud of the fence on that pass. I just prefer the solid feel of full-length fence support.

And as has already been suggested, I’d start with oversized stock that is still stable when the profile is fully routed, and later cut the molding free in table saw mode. To minimize material waste, you can probably produce a molding on both sides of the oversized stock.

br549

Thanks for all of the insights, suggestions, comments and questions. You have all given me several things to think about. I'll try to answer all questions in the order they were received:

edma194: I do have some wide stock I could try using a hand-held router on, and then rip the finished profile to width, so I will give that a try. My Shopsmith is a Mark V 500, so the faster RPM of hand-held router should also help. My thought to use the Shopsmith, even with it's slower speed, was because I didn't think a bit this large could (or should) be used in a hand-held router.

thunderbirdbat: Yes, feed direction was one of my main concerns. After others' comments about feed direction, if I try using the Shopsmith, it will be with the bit "buried" in an auxiliary fence, and not with the workpiece trapped between the fence and the bit.

DLB: My initial thought was that the stock will be a rough 1 x 2, so greater than 1.5" tall. I may not be able to cut the entire profile of the bit. After drawing a more detailed profile of what I want, I may have to use a larger piece to get the size I need. The idea of cutting the profile on a wider board and then ripping the profiled edge off is seeming more and more like the better way to proceed.

Hobbyman2: My initial thought was the cut would be on face of a rough 1 x 2, or the edge of a rough 2 x 6. The desired finished profile and size is now this. The full 2" height is not completely necessary, but I do want to be able to slope the top piece of the moulding enough to match the slope of the pyramid shaped cap for bearing and gluing surface. It will be trim around a 6 x 6 post cap for a fence post. (Posts are a rough 6 x 6, so an "off-the shelf" post cap for a S4S 6 x 6 is too small.)

BuckeyeDennis: The thread about trapping the workpiece was quite informative. My rough 2 x 6 cedar may wind up getting ripped into rough 2 x 2's and the profile cut on 2 faces before being ripped in half to get two pieces.

I'll post my test run results after I get to that stage.

Post Cap.jpg

BuckeyeDennis

Your bit also struck me as pretty big to use in a handheld router. I didn't know what the "official" advise was on that, though, so I Googled it just now.

This Woodworkers Guild of America article says "Bits larger than 1” in diameter or longer than 1-½” should not be used in a freehand router—switch to a router table for those cutters." Your bit exceeds both dimensions. But those dimensions are undoubtedly just a rule of thumb. If you have an edge guide for your router and adjust it to take to take several light cuts, I expect that you'd be OK.

That edge-guide setup kind of blurs the line between handheld routing and table routing.

edma194

Thank you BuckeyeDennis, those are good guidelines to follow. br549, I think you should be ok with a handheld router on pine or cedar taking several passes, if you have an edge guide, but don't do this if you are not comfortable with it. The article linked above is a good guide to follow. If you use your ShopsmithI think the advice to use a shaper fence to rout in front of the bit is a good idea.

Hobbyman2

JOM ,,, by rearranging the head stock and table carriage and making the cut from the bottom sounds a lot more stable than making this on a face cut , simply remove the table and carriage, remove and flip the head stock around and reinsert the table and carriage , stand it up as the drill press , this brings the quill in from the bottom of the table , add a shaper table insert and then add a good sacrificial fence to the table fence ,the bit will be burried into the fence and the guide bushing should be flush with the fence , this will operate close to a router table and it will give you a stable support for the stock, my guess it would be easier to make the cut on a 2x stock and then like ED said just cut off to the desired thickness . if you are painting the wood ,, the grain wont be seen . you can make a wood table insert to fit the bit if you dont have one . this is only opinion because the other advise will work as well .

Ed in Tampa

Running wood between the fence and router bit will lead to shooting board around. How do I know because I did it. Snatched a board out my hand accelerated it up to nearly router bit speed and shot it across my yard over to my neighbors. No harm done but scared me enough that I had to change my pants. Hate to think what may of happened if my hand was dragged into bit. Learned never never never trap wood between cutter and fence.

In fact, it just dawned on me, I was making the cuts needed to make the block you see in my avatar. I was testing a straight cutting bit on a test piece of wood to see if the Shopsmith speed would be able to make the cut. It was and is by the way. In fact my avatar was made exclusively on the Shopsmith 510 model. No router needed just the confidence that the machine would do it.

Hobbyman2

I hear ya , glad that was all that happened, keeping the deepest part of the cut on the table sounds a lot safer . If the OP has a router / shaper fence it would be even better than a sacrificial fence . on the final pass a feather board can keep the piece from chattering and save some sanding.

Hobbyman2

One thing that I haven't seen mention is the grain of the wood during the cut , a thin piece can explode or try to kick back especially on a thinner piece if the grain changes directions . might stand a better chance of success with a thicker piece of wood ?

edflorence

br549 wrote My Shopsmith is a Mark V 500, so the faster RPM of hand-held router should also help. My thought to use the Shopsmith, even with it's slower speed, was because I didn't think a bit this large could (or should) be used in a hand-held router.

Just a thought...with a Shopsmith Speed Increaser you can get the advantages of under the table routing and increased RPM. Using the speed increaser, my Mark V 500 at the "V" setting spins at 10,800 RPM, which is a good speed for large bits like the one you are using.

JPG

I am having trouble visualizing the projectile scenario if the proper plow feed direction is utilized. Thrown back I understand.

Hobbyman2

Hard wood v/s soft wood are 2 different beast with a bit that size ?

br549

An update to what I tried and how well it worked.

Using a hand-held router was tried first. I temporarily attached the stock to the edge of a 2 x 6 so the router would have a large surface on which to ride. This produced pretty good results, but attaching and de-attaching over 50 pieces of stock seemed like a lot of work. And cutting the full profile in one pass would have been a bit much to try. I could have set up an edge guide to make multiple passes, but again more work.

Next I tried the Shopsmith. When I set it up in the drill press position, too many things slipped or didn't work well. Gravity was not working in my favor.

Finally tried with the Shopsmith in the horizontal position with the table tilted 90 degrees. Made an auxiliary fence and attached to the fence so that the router bit could be buried in the fence. My "L" shaped guides made of 2 x 4's to keep the stock pressed down to the fence and against the table did not work well. Limited my view of where the stock was, and hard to adjust. Any slight variation in the width of the stock and it took too much effort to push the stock through, even with waxing the inside surfaces of the guides and the fence.

My feather boards bolted loosely together worked best for holding the stock down to the fence. Once adjusted, a large C-clamp kept them in position and provided the desired amount of pressure on the stock. The bolt head on the table side rode in the miter slot. A lock nut kept the nut from vibrating loose, and it was loose enough to allow the feather boards to be adjusted.

Adding height to the wood auxiliary fence gave more support for the stock, and a place to clamp thinner feather boards to keep the stock pressed tight to the table. Another feather board on the outboard side of the cutter would be better I think.

Stock that I used was old 1 x 6 cedar T & G siding that I salvaged when I re-sided part of the house last year. Cut pieces down to 1 x 4's. Found I could cut two profiles on each 1 x 4 (on opposite sides) and be able to rip them apart at roughly a 30 degree angle to give me the sloped top edge I wanted to glue to the underside of the post caps.

I took three passes to get the completed profile, lowering table slightly between passes. Depending on the grain, there was a varying amount of chatter. If one side cut clean and smoothly, then the other side usually chattered more as I was then going in the opposite direction of the grain.

Here is short video of making third and final pass. https://www.dropbox.com/s/m0gyfoaxwk0ioqn/Moulding.mp4?dl=0

Hobbyman2

The wood grain makes all the difference in the world when making molding. some of those chip outs can be eliminated by making verry verry shallow cuts , but there is no guarantee . hard wood is really bad for this , also it would appear your feather boards could be stood up a bit straighter , just a opinion ,, the saw cuts in the feather boards could be a little thinner ,, say from a band saw , that may help with vibration and chatter ,,, it Looks good !!

edflorence

Very clever setup and it made for good looking results. Thanks for sharing. Also, it's further proof that the Shopsmith can work well as a router/shaper.

JPG

Some things bear watching.