54 Greenie Restore

jcraigie · Post by **jcraigie** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:37 pm

I can't tell if you have a clutch or not.

If not since your taking it apart you might want to talk to Bill Mayo about getting one of his rebuillt clutches.

Glad you got her apart okey Dokey

mrhart · Post by **mrhart** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:11 pm

There is no clutch mech. I understand it is an A headstock, should it have one? What is the advantage there if it was originally made without. I need more education apparantly

jcraigie · Post by **jcraigie** » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:51 am

The clutch would be inside of the cogs that the gilmer belt rides on on the part you just removed. It allows the clutch to slip if the shopsmith tries to stop from a catch or something instead of trashing the belt. If you can get one cheap I would put it in (again check with Bill Mayo). With Bills help I rebuilt mine and it was pretty interesting.

Actually, I may have an extra that you can have. Let me check when I get home in the morning and I'll get back with you.

mrhart · Post by **mrhart** » Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:48 am

To summerize, would an A headstock always be a gilmer drive with clutch? Are all greenies the same? Lastly are Reeves drives another name for Gilmer drive? Sorry guys, just want to be smarter..

terrydowning · Post by **terrydowning** » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:04 pm

mrhart wrote:To summerize, would an A headstock always be a gilmer drive with clutch? Are all greenies the same? Lastly are Reeves drives another name for Gilmer drive? Sorry guys, just want to be smarter..

"Reeves Drive" refers to the continuously variable transmission.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuously_variable_transmission

The arrangement between the control sheave and floating sheave. I'm surprised this isn't a more common design choice in machinery of this type.

"Gilmer" drive refers to how the control sheave in the "Reeves Drive" receives power. Early 50s models have a Gilmer Drive with the cogs. This was replaced with the newer drive system (Can't remember the name as I don't have one.)

The down side of the Gilmer drive is that in the event of sudden stoppage, there is nothing to prevent damage to the drive belt. A clutch mechanism was added to solve this problem. In the event of sudden stoppage, the inertial forces engage the clutch and allow the drive to come to a stop while preventing the belt from having teeth torn off. If the clutch is not working properly, it's the same as not having a clutch. The down side here, unless you test your clutch, you won't know it's malfunctioning until your belt is damaged.

The newer drive system has no cogs on the belt and there fore does not have the same problem as the gilmer drive. In a suddens top scenario, the belt can slip against the drive until everything comes to a stop.

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:35 pm

mrhart wrote:To summerize, would an A headstock always be a gilmer drive with clutch? Are all greenies the same? Lastly are Reeves drives another name for Gilmer drive? Sorry guys, just want to be smarter..

All Greenies and early Goldies have Gilmer belts. All 3/4hp machines are 'Gilmer'. The Gilmer belt transfers power from the idler shaft to the main shaft. IIUC the clutch was added as an after thought, but I may have that bas-ackwards.

I am not sure, but there may be a correlation between the "A' / 'B' headstock and the clutch.

Early Greenies had 'A' headstocks, and all later versions had 'B' headstocks until the 'C' headstock was created.

Reeves drive refers to the variable sheave hardware. Gilmer merely refers to the belt/hubs.

The Poly-v belt was released with the later Goldies along with the 1 1/8hp motor improvement. IIUC, Early Goldies were manufactured by Yuba Tool Co. and Later Goldies were manufactured by Magna American.

Bear in mind that any of these versions can be modified into any of the other and can also be mixed/matched. So used stuff can be any of the combinations!;) However the idler shaft, main shaft, quill,belt must all match.

mrhart · Post by **mrhart** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:42 am

jcraigie wrote:The clutch would be inside of the cogs that the gilmer belt rides on on the part you just removed. It allows the clutch to slip if the shopsmith tries to stop from a catch or something instead of trashing the belt. If you can get one cheap I would put it in (again check with Bill Mayo). With Bills help I rebuilt mine and it was pretty interesting.

Actually, I may have an extra that you can have. Let me check when I get home in the morning and I'll get back with you.

Not much time the last few nights, but YES she is clutched. A whole nother aspect. Let me know if you have one. I remember (maybe in your retore post) there was some info on testing.
A reminder here, she was running pretty smooth and I have only the 520 to compare it to, but after I horizontally bored some holes for a cutting board, I thought there might be a bearing issue in the quill, and I was pretty sure I could hear some bearing noise. I did find the bearing closest to the gilmer belt does need to be replaced. The belts and splines look good (but will replace belts). So my clutch may be fine?

mrhart · Post by **mrhart** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:46 am

Battery Drill w/Wire Brush Attachment Tip of the Day:

When running an 18v battery drill on high speed with a wire brush attachment, never let the brush come in contact with a loose t-shirt that you are currently wearing. Reverse is a great feature of the battery drill.

Cleaning and inspecting parts stage, also finished stripping paint off of the headstock. I think I mentioned this but, when cleaning the holes for bearings and tubes on the headstock, I used (brillo?) type pads I bought at lowes a while back. I have 3 different "grits". When I use the mediaum or grey one, I get a great shine and it takes all the junk off. Anything stubborn and I hit it lightly with the green one. Then give it a final polish with the "fine" white one.
Should I be putting a little mineral spirits on a rag for a final cleaning?
And should these surfaces be lubed with something before assembley like a cylinder would?

JPG · Post by **JPG** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 11:15 am

[quote="mrhart"]Battery Drill w/Wire Brush Attachment Tip of the Day:

When running an 18v battery drill on high speed with a wire brush attachment, never let the brush come in contact with a loose t-shirt that you are currently wearing. Reverse is a great feature of the battery drill.
]

Clean em and wax em(lightly). I like to apply graphie!

billmayo · Post by **billmayo** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:47 pm

The first Greenies (1954-1955?) had a solid drive sleeve hub. I have only found a few of these solid hubs which I removed and replaced with the drive sleeve clutch as the Gilmer belt had lost all of its teeth on each one or broke.

The Gilmer clutch is a finely designed unit with very close tolerances. It took me many years to find a way to add an additional clutch disk and plate to make up for the worn disks. These disks and plates are only available from used units. I never found a new replacement for them. I find 10-20 ft pounds of torque is needed to allow the clutch to function (slip) correctly. Almost all Gilmer clutches I test are frozen from from years of no slippage. I find a few that no longer proving any drive force (mostly slipping).