Mark 510 Tube Alignment

[dusty]

If you have been following the thread on Extension Table alignment, you are aware of the issues that I now believe impact Extension Table interchangeability. The contributing factors are several but one of them is the relationship of the Way Tubes to the Bench Tubes. The Ways must be "centered" over the Bench Tubes to achieve proper alignment.

With the 510, the Head Rest lock does this to some degree but I have prepared a video that is intended to show how ineffective it is. To completely understand, you will probably need to do this for yourself on your own 510 (with or without Double Tilt). With Double Tilt there is less movement but there is still some.

This video clip does nothing more than communicate to those interested, what I am attempting to show.

Shaft and Tube Angle Verification.png (107.97 KiB) Viewed 3539 times

On the 510 without Double Tilt, this relationship can be easily altered. In fact, it probably happens every time the headrest is unlocked and then locked. I woke up early this morning thinking about this and got up (even without waiting for morning coffee) and went to the shop to do this. It is not very professional and has not audio but it shows what I am talking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsxkFSN ... e=youtu.be

No attempt is being made to resolve this problem or to even prove that it is a problem. I leave that to the user that has a issue with exchanging locations of their Extension Table from one end of the Mark to the other.

[JPG]

What are the two upper/outer circles?

[Skizzity]

What are the two upper/outer circles?

Extension tubes for main table?

[dusty]

What are the two upper/outer circles?

Extension tubes for main table?

Thank you! Before JPG asks or otherwise makes the point, this sketch is not intended to depict the vertical movement of the Main Table (thus the extension tubes).

I should probably modify that drawing to include a saw blade too.

[JPG]

Thank you. Saw blade not needed.

[jsburger]

I totally agree. That solves the yaw issue. How did you solve the pitch and roll problem that I thought you had also? OK, Jim's answer seems to resolve the pitch issue on 510's but not the roll problem.

[dusty]

If I had a clear understanding of yaw, pitch and roll, I might be able to answer your question.

Since I don't, suffice it to say that all I have done is table alignments (main and extension tables) while paying strict attention to all effecting details. Also, make certain that you know the idiosyncrasies of any Wixey or angle cube that you might use to verify table tilt. Table tilt angle obviously effects the measurements of the outboard tables. A very little bit of tilt creates a significant error 48" away.

[jsburger]

If I had a clear understanding of yaw, pitch and roll, I might be able to answer your question.

Since I don't, suffice it to say that all I have done is table alignments (main and extension tables) while paying strict attention to all effecting details. Also, make certain that you know the idiosyncrasies of any Wixey or angle cube that you might use to verify table tilt. Table tilt angle obviously effects the measurements of the outboard tables. A very little bit of tilt creates a significant error 48" away.

Yaw is twist left and right horizontally. That is what you said you fixed (I think) with the wedges to space the double tilt castings.

Pitch is up and down front to back. That is what Jim said about the elusive set screw on the model 500+ back way tube.

Roll is left or right tilt. That has not been discussed. Mine do not work with the double tilt.

I have never used the Wixey to assume the tables are correct. I use a Veritas 48" straight edge and feeler gauge across the tables.



As Jim said us double tilt users need to have two fixed tables.

[dusty]

My Shorty began life as something different than it is now. It is labeled a 510R and carries a serial number of SS-152166. This is the first time that I realized that the SN was preceded by the SS-. Strange the things we don't notice or don't pay attention to.

But my question is this: Does the fact that it is labeled as a 510R indicate that it was originally a 500 that was factory upgraded to the 510?

The casting is certainly different than my 510 (no nibs) and the headstock and carriage mate up with slightly different dimensions. Most noticeable to me is the fact that the center of the table insert does not align with the blade as it did/does on my 510. It is offset about 1/8" to the right. Can be compensated for by using the quill and might be altered when I do a full table alignment. This unit has trunnions with the enlarged mounting holes.

[reible]

My Shorty began life as something different than it is now. It is labeled a 510R and carries a serial number of SS-152166. This is the first time that I realized that the SN was preceded by the SS-. Strange the things we don't notice or don't pay attention to.

But my question is this: Does the fact that it is labeled as a 510R indicate that it was originally a 500 that was factory upgraded to the 510?

The casting is certainly different than my 510 (no nibs) and the headstock and carriage mate up with slightly different dimensions. Most noticeable to me is the fact that the center of the table insert does not align with the blade as it did/does on my 510. It is offset about 1/8" to the right. Can be compensated for by using the quill and might be altered when I do a full table alignment. This unit has trunnions with the enlarged mounting holes.

We have no of knowing if the upgrade was done at the factory or not as the sticker with the 510R came with the package so anyone could have added it. My 510 has the new rails etc so the sticker was shipped at least for a while after the introduction... again it would help date things if we knew when the stick was no longer included.

Ed