If you were to loosen the set screws on the tie bar, would it then touch? And if so, what would that do to the rest of the alignment?dusty wrote:The setscrew on my machine does not even touch the tie bar.
The dance with Lady Green begins ...
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Heath
Central Louisiana
-10ER - SN 13927, Born 1949, Acquired October 2008, Restored November, 2008
-10ER - SN 35630, Born 1950, Acquired April 2009, Restored May 2009, A34 Jigsaw
-Mark V - SN 212052, Born 1986, Acquired Sept 2009, Restored March 2010, Bandsaw
-10ER - SN 39722, Born 1950, Acquired March 2011, awaiting restoration
Central Louisiana
-10ER - SN 13927, Born 1949, Acquired October 2008, Restored November, 2008
-10ER - SN 35630, Born 1950, Acquired April 2009, Restored May 2009, A34 Jigsaw
-Mark V - SN 212052, Born 1986, Acquired Sept 2009, Restored March 2010, Bandsaw
-10ER - SN 39722, Born 1950, Acquired March 2011, awaiting restoration
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dusty
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 21481
- Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2006 6:52 am
- Location: Tucson (Wildcat Country), Arizona
No. The setscrew is directly below the tie bar with about a 1/4" gap.heathicus wrote:If you were to loosen the set screws on the tie bar, would it then touch? And if so, what would that do to the rest of the alignment?
I have previously attempted to utilize the set screw (after some Sawdust Session I think) but it never worked for me and I dropped it. Mike's pictures very clearly show that the screw for some reason does something. I just don't understand how.
I don't want to check out of this world with this sort of unanswered question bugging me. So simple and yet so hard.
"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.
Interesting. I don't really understand why that happens. Do you also have the headstock and carriage locks free? With those locks and the tie bar loose, I don't understand how the tube wouldn't touch the set screw on the headrest.dusty wrote:No. The setscrew is directly below the tie bar with about a 1/4" gap.Heathicus wrote:If you were to loosen the set screws on the tie bar, would it then touch?
I can't explain it either.dusty wrote:I have previously attempted to utilize the set screw (after some Sawdust Session I think) but it never worked for me and I dropped it. Mike's pictures very clearly show that the screw for some reason does something. I just don't understand how.
I don't want to check out of this world with this sort of unanswered question bugging me. So simple and yet so hard.
EDIT: Ok, I think I can explain it. The set screw adjusts the "twist" of the tubes, with the axis being the other tube. I hope the graphic below explains what I am suggesting. It's not entirely accurate, obviously. For one thing you have a second pivot point at the other end of the machine.
[ATTACH]8828[/ATTACH]
And with the tie bar loose, and the headstock and carriage locks loose, both tubes should touch the head rest. If the tube over the set screw still does not touch... then I have no explanation for that.
Of course, I could also have all of this completely wrong...
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Heath
Central Louisiana
-10ER - SN 13927, Born 1949, Acquired October 2008, Restored November, 2008
-10ER - SN 35630, Born 1950, Acquired April 2009, Restored May 2009, A34 Jigsaw
-Mark V - SN 212052, Born 1986, Acquired Sept 2009, Restored March 2010, Bandsaw
-10ER - SN 39722, Born 1950, Acquired March 2011, awaiting restoration
Central Louisiana
-10ER - SN 13927, Born 1949, Acquired October 2008, Restored November, 2008
-10ER - SN 35630, Born 1950, Acquired April 2009, Restored May 2009, A34 Jigsaw
-Mark V - SN 212052, Born 1986, Acquired Sept 2009, Restored March 2010, Bandsaw
-10ER - SN 39722, Born 1950, Acquired March 2011, awaiting restoration
Quill debate: single vs. double
I did try to search this out in the forum, but came up with no conclusion. I did see a post by farmer about the 2nd bearing being a response to competitive pressure and possibly overkill on accuracy (after all, the wood itself in anything we make "moves"), and thought it was a very good comment (because I agreed with it!).
But, I'm going to bite the bullet, put on my flame-proof overalls and ask....
Is it possible to upgrade an OLD Mark V (this one is a '55) to the double bearing quill by simply replacing;
the quill (obviously)
the drive assembly - to get 14-spline, poly-v
the idler assembly - to match the drive
new poly-V belt (again, obviously)
Or, are there dimensional variations between a Gilmer and a poly-v that I have not read about?
As an update, I did turn a couple of cylinders with holes for bearing presses and have replaced the bearing on my quill and re-installed the bearing on the drive. So now I'm priming parts and getting close to reassembly.
But, I'm going to bite the bullet, put on my flame-proof overalls and ask....
Is it possible to upgrade an OLD Mark V (this one is a '55) to the double bearing quill by simply replacing;
the quill (obviously)
the drive assembly - to get 14-spline, poly-v
the idler assembly - to match the drive
new poly-V belt (again, obviously)
Or, are there dimensional variations between a Gilmer and a poly-v that I have not read about?
As an update, I did turn a couple of cylinders with holes for bearing presses and have replaced the bearing on my quill and re-installed the bearing on the drive. So now I'm priming parts and getting close to reassembly.
'55 Greenie #292284 (Mar-55), '89 SS 510 #020989, Mark VII #408551 (sold 10/14/12), SS Band Saw, (SS 500 #36063 (May-79) now gone to son-in-law as of 11-11), Magna bandsaw, Magna jointer 16185 (May-54), Magna belt sander SS28712 (Dec-82), Magna jigsaw SS4397 (Dec-78), SS biscuit joiner, Zyliss (knockoff) vise, 20+ hand planes, 60s Craftsman tablesaw, CarbaTec mini-lathe, and the usual pile of tools. Hermit of the Hills Woodworks, a hillbilly in the foothills of the Ozarks, scraping by.
YES you can upgrade the gilmer belt to a poly-v belt. BUT it will COST ya plenty. So keep the gilmer system.
SS 500(09/1980), DC3300, jointer, bandsaw, belt sander, Strip Sander, drum sanders,molder, dado, biscuit joiner, universal lathe tool rest, Oneway talon chuck, router bits & chucks and a De Walt 735 planer,a #5,#6, block planes. ALL in a 100 square foot shop.
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Bob
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Bob
yeahhh, but .....
Oh, I'm perfectly happy with the Gilmer drive, but I was just pondering if I could pick up all the parts cheap enough on evil-bay to warrant the "upgrade", if indeed it is any kind of upgrade. Has anyone seriously looked into this Gilmer vs. poly-v thing? I don't actually see my woodworking ever needing to be micro-fine.beeg wrote:YES you can upgrade the gilmer belt to a poly-v belt. BUT it will COST ya plenty. So keep the gilmer system.
'55 Greenie #292284 (Mar-55), '89 SS 510 #020989, Mark VII #408551 (sold 10/14/12), SS Band Saw, (SS 500 #36063 (May-79) now gone to son-in-law as of 11-11), Magna bandsaw, Magna jointer 16185 (May-54), Magna belt sander SS28712 (Dec-82), Magna jigsaw SS4397 (Dec-78), SS biscuit joiner, Zyliss (knockoff) vise, 20+ hand planes, 60s Craftsman tablesaw, CarbaTec mini-lathe, and the usual pile of tools. Hermit of the Hills Woodworks, a hillbilly in the foothills of the Ozarks, scraping by.
The upgrade was about $600.00. The 2 bearing quill upgrade is for the poly-v systems.
SS 500(09/1980), DC3300, jointer, bandsaw, belt sander, Strip Sander, drum sanders,molder, dado, biscuit joiner, universal lathe tool rest, Oneway talon chuck, router bits & chucks and a De Walt 735 planer,a #5,#6, block planes. ALL in a 100 square foot shop.
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Bob
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Bob
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JPG
- Platinum Member
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- Location: Lexington, Ky (TAMECAT territory)
heathicus wrote:Interesting. I don't really understand why that happens. Do you also have the headstock and carriage locks free? With those locks and the tie bar loose, I don't understand how the tube wouldn't touch the set screw on the headrest.
I can't explain it either.
EDIT: Ok, I think I can explain it. The set screw adjusts the "twist" of the tubes, with the axis being the other tube. I hope the graphic below explains what I am suggesting. It's not entirely accurate, obviously. For one thing you have a second pivot point at the other end of the machine.
[ATTACH]8828[/ATTACH]
And with the tie bar loose, and the headstock and carriage locks loose, both tubes should touch the head rest. If the tube over the set screw still does not touch... then I have no explanation for that.
Of course, I could also have all of this completely wrong...
More on this subject!
https://forum.shopsmith.com/viewtopic.php?t=3823
As Mickyd found out, it can also compensate for mis alignment of an spt to the aux shaft(which may vary depending on eccentric[elt tension] adjustment).
The new off set mounting tubes allow adjusting spt independently from the tube/twist stop screw.
Dusty: Your frame must be twisted(tubes not parallel). I am referring to all four being parallel. The legs will compensate for any floor unevenness etc. Use that wixey to check them! Two planes!(end to end, front to rear)
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╟JPG ╢
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
╟JPG ╢
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E[/size](SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange
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mickyd
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Heath's great graphic in post 93 shows why the set screw works. Apply the graphic to the headstock vs. the tailstock as shown and you can see that what it does is applies a twist of the way tubes relative to the bench tubes thus aligning the rear drive shaft of the headstock to an STP mounted in the tailstock. Great pictorial Heath.dusty wrote:No. The setscrew is directly below the tie bar with about a 1/4" gap.
I have previously attempted to utilize the set screw (after some Sawdust Session I think) but it never worked for me and I dropped it. Mike's pictures very clearly show that the screw for some reason does something. I just don't understand how.
I don't want to check out of this world with this sort of unanswered question bugging me. So simple and yet so hard.
Mike
Sunny San Diego
Sunny San Diego
Thanks JPG
Thanks JPG for searching this out for us. It certainly was not making much sense to me until your last post. Now I have one more item to add to my list for realignment after reassembly. And I can see now where this could be very important for lathe operations using the tailstock, which is one of the primary functions for which I intend to use my Lady Green.
'55 Greenie #292284 (Mar-55), '89 SS 510 #020989, Mark VII #408551 (sold 10/14/12), SS Band Saw, (SS 500 #36063 (May-79) now gone to son-in-law as of 11-11), Magna bandsaw, Magna jointer 16185 (May-54), Magna belt sander SS28712 (Dec-82), Magna jigsaw SS4397 (Dec-78), SS biscuit joiner, Zyliss (knockoff) vise, 20+ hand planes, 60s Craftsman tablesaw, CarbaTec mini-lathe, and the usual pile of tools. Hermit of the Hills Woodworks, a hillbilly in the foothills of the Ozarks, scraping by.